Writing sheet music with the Yamaha Montage

Welcome to the new era from the company that brought you the DX and the Motif. Montage sets the next milestone with sophisticated dynamic control, massive sound creation and streamlined workflow.

Moderators: Derek, parametric, Saul

User avatar Israel
Chummy
Member
Member
Posts: 28
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2018 5:15 pm

Writing sheet music with the Yamaha Montage

Unread post by Chummy » Wed Nov 07, 2018 10:59 pm

Hello friends!

How would I go about writing PDF sheet music of my personal arrangements (for existing songs) and original piano solo pieces?
It's been literally many years since I touched Sibelius, (Cubase user) but I wonder is the best way is simply MIDI-ing it up to Sibelius using USB, (or any other *better* software you guys recommend for doing this? I've been out of the game too long IDK what to get right now) - recording my own performance and making the necessary tweaks/fixes/quantization afterwards?

Thanks!
User avatar Ireland
Saul
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 11728
Joined: Sun Feb 01, 2004 1:00 am
Contact:

Re: Writing sheet music with the Yamaha Montage

Unread post by Saul » Wed Nov 07, 2018 11:14 pm

That's an interesting question. I think many people are still using either Sibelius or Finale. Yamaha of course have their own software called 'Dorico' which you may want to check out. We have a couple of people on the forum who have used it so may be able to tell you more about how it works.

I mainly play guitar and as far as I know none of the current batch of scoring software is able to take audio from a guitar and successfully turn it into an accurate score. Not that I would need it as I doubt anyone would want to have a transcript of my music but as I play for myself that doesn't really matter.

Let me know if you do try Dorico as I am always interested to hear how people are getting on with it.
Saul
Site Admin
Subscribe To Our YouTube Channel!
Review Yamahamusicians.com on Trustpilot
Sign up to the Newsletter
Follow us on Twitter @YamahaMusicians
Follow Us On Facebook
Follow Us On Tumblr
Dowina Acoustic Guitars: Dowina Cabernet DC
Dowina Chardonnay GAC DS - Dowina Rustica GAC - Dowina Marus - Dowina Puella

CASIO PX-S1000/Vintage VE2000GG Gordon Giltrap/Ibanez AE245/Arturia Keylab 61 MKII/Arturia Analog Lab 3/Arturia Piano V2/Pianoteq 6 Pro/Apple iMac 27"/Logic Pro X/Ableton Live 10/Behringer QX1202USB Mixer/Presonus Eris 4.5 Active Monitors. Makro Racer
User avatar Israel
Chummy
Member
Member
Posts: 28
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2018 5:15 pm

Re: Writing sheet music with the Yamaha Montage

Unread post by Chummy » Wed Nov 14, 2018 12:00 am

That's a shame Saul. You'd think with all the current tech guitar makers would step up their game and come up with new gizmos. IIRC there was this casio plastic guitar in the 80s that used to read MIDI but it was a toy and I'm not sure how far have we gotten today if any.

Frankly I've never heard this name "Dorico" before! Will defo google it and see what I can find, and if there are people here who can give additional input I'd like that. When I compose I always do so in front of a piano, or in my head then straight to the piano to solidify the musical idea. I really need the notation software to read midi so I can work like in "Cubase" when you just play whatever and use quantize /other tweaks afterwords. I can't be bothered using the mouse to draw every note since I'm a millennial.

On a side note I was at the national library today at a special tour arranged for our small group of music students by our uni. I couldn't believe how many prolific and important composers had the patience of writing EVERYTHING on paper seeing the actual original archives. I guess libraries will soon start a Sibelius/Finale/ USB score archives as I doubt many new composers will continue writing with a pen for much longer. Sorry for rambling.
User avatar Great Britain
parametric
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 3720
Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2010 1:00 am
Contact:

Re: Writing sheet music with the Yamaha Montage

Unread post by parametric » Wed Nov 14, 2018 1:51 am

Hi Chummy,

I did start a review of Dorico, but other stuff got in the way and I've yet to return to it . . . .

My initial impressions are mentioned here: viewtopic.php?f=166&t=11145#p65966

I think the key to getting something sensible in the score requires extremely intelligent use of Quantisation to rationalise

the High definition that Midi affords.

As Human players we play our Music such that it "feels" right - so "roughly" 4/4, and possibly a crochet=100

"most" of the Time.

Midi of course will see this, rind, pips and all, and write it as such on the score - which will be a nightmare to read back.

Most composers start out writing notes on a stave . . .

The GRIND aspect to score-writing is being truthful that what you just played on the keyboard is correctly represented

by the notes you have written. There can be different ways of writing the same thing . . . :confusion-confused:

ONE way WILL be the easiest to read back . . . so this in the one to choose . . .

PROOF of the Pudding is getting another player to read what you have written.

DOES it sound the same as what YOU played? If it does - then you have WON . . . .

Writing Score only really comes together with regular PRACTICE, as most will agree it's an arduous task,

it's really the last thing we want to be doing :roll:

Notation S/W comes to the rescue here, but still needs to be LEARNED, but pays back the effort by giving you

a beautifully neat result that make for easy reading by the players . . . ((i))

parametric
Alesis Fusion 8SSD AND 6SSD - BOTH are 384Mb/120Gb SSD/Akai ADVANCE61/Yamaha MOXF6/1024Mb Flash Ram/Yamaha SY85/8.5mb vol/1024k non-vol/DX21/Roland MT32/Bachmann double overstrung Baby Grand Piano/Win10 Pro/Ubuntu MATE 15.0.4/iBook G4/Mac OS 10.4.6/ProTools 7.4/MBox2/M-Audio MicroTrack 24/96

NI Komplete11 Ultimate

Sector101 2x SYEMB06 / 4 x EXM-E3 128MB DRAM Module

BRAND NEW DSDD (720k) FLOPPY DISKS FOR SALE - http://www.yamahaforums.co.uk/forum/vie ... =22&t=9217

Watch out now! take care, BEWARE of the greedy leaders! They'll take you where you should not go - (George Harrison)

IT'S TRUE - "MONEY TALKS" - TO ME, IT MOSTLY SAYS "GOODBYE" ;-)
http://www.chrisnmiller.co.uk/Chris
User avatar Israel
Chummy
Member
Member
Posts: 28
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2018 5:15 pm

Re: Writing sheet music with the Yamaha Montage

Unread post by Chummy » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:15 pm

I am savvy with notation softwares in general. I wonder if Dorico is even worth it being able to get Musescore for free !
User avatar Ireland
Saul
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 11728
Joined: Sun Feb 01, 2004 1:00 am
Contact:

Re: Writing sheet music with the Yamaha Montage

Unread post by Saul » Wed Nov 14, 2018 10:12 pm

I have played around with MIDI guitar and the closest I got to something workable was the Fishman TriplePlay system which fits to any guitar and transmits MIDI wirelessly to any software you want. It was "ok" but like every other MIDI guitar device you need to adapt your playing quite a bit in order to avoid triggering unwanted notes.

What we need is some advanced Ai that can transcribe from audio in real time. Don't think that will be happening for a while yet :(

Dorico has a trial version so always worth giving it a go https://www.dorico.com/

If I remember correctly there were issues importing certain scores and I think Chris may have come across that himself?

Musescore looks like an interesting alternative. I had not heard of it before but then notation is not something I have really ever been involved in. It is free though so definitely worth a try.

Chummy if you do try Musescore can you report back and let us know how you get on with it?
Saul
Site Admin
Subscribe To Our YouTube Channel!
Review Yamahamusicians.com on Trustpilot
Sign up to the Newsletter
Follow us on Twitter @YamahaMusicians
Follow Us On Facebook
Follow Us On Tumblr
Dowina Acoustic Guitars: Dowina Cabernet DC
Dowina Chardonnay GAC DS - Dowina Rustica GAC - Dowina Marus - Dowina Puella

CASIO PX-S1000/Vintage VE2000GG Gordon Giltrap/Ibanez AE245/Arturia Keylab 61 MKII/Arturia Analog Lab 3/Arturia Piano V2/Pianoteq 6 Pro/Apple iMac 27"/Logic Pro X/Ableton Live 10/Behringer QX1202USB Mixer/Presonus Eris 4.5 Active Monitors. Makro Racer
User avatar Israel
Chummy
Member
Member
Posts: 28
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2018 5:15 pm

Re: Writing sheet music with the Yamaha Montage

Unread post by Chummy » Wed Nov 14, 2018 10:23 pm

Yes of course I will. I am a bit busy in the next couple of days (moved an apartment, etc.) but when I will eventually get to it I will update for sure.
I Will be trying Musescore with the Montage as I don't feel like pirating Sibelius or paying heaps of cash for Dorico which has a lot of reported bugs :P

I think since the piano is a percussion instrument (like drums) it never had any problem with MIDI implementation. Electronic drum sets work really well too actually, I had a Roland V Drum set two years back. Not sure why nobody is pushing (AFAIK) for that smart AI solution or at least some really advanced MIDI guitar system that would feel like a real guitar and provide 100% accuracy. I mean, I am surprised because guitar is probably the most played instrument in the world, thus people coming out with solutions can make big buck.
User avatar United States of America
dannyrichardson
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2019 6:12 pm

Re: Writing sheet music with the Yamaha Montage

Unread post by dannyrichardson » Mon Feb 11, 2019 6:23 pm

If you use a DAW you can transpose the MIDI to see the sheet music. Just record the MIDI from your Montage into your DAW.
User avatar Israel
Chummy
Member
Member
Posts: 28
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2018 5:15 pm

Re: Writing sheet music with the Yamaha Montage

Unread post by Chummy » Fri Mar 29, 2019 2:46 pm

So I promised to update about notation softwares.

I did try Musescore and I think it's horrible. definitely a sharp learning curve and not intuitive whatsoever for a beginner. But I wouldn't complain since it's free!

So I ended up buying Dorico Elements 2 .. comparing to experience using Sibelius 7, Dorico is much nicer to look at for starters. As a comparison, I have both Abelton 10 and Cubase 9 PRO ..Abelton's GUI frustrates me every single time, including its lack of intuitiveness if that's a word in English. I've got a good inclination for design and layout having experience with Photoshop and although I'm not a professional of course I personally (and possibly every second high school student in existence) could do a better job than the people who created Abelton. Cut to the point Sibelius is full of menues and unnessecary features nobody uses, Dorico is neat and only has what you actually need upfront and the rest is hidden so if you need something unimportant you would only rarely use you would need to open a menu.

Then again, I'm missing the small box where all the notes/dynamics/expressions are, I think Sibelius has done a better job on that. Also in order to add bars, or lower/up note by certain pitch or +/- octave you need 2 buttons pressed while at least for pitch up/down in sibelius you can use only the arrow keys. A minor inconvenice, IDK if Dorico grants customization of those options actually.

Other than that I'm more happy with Dorico but since I'm a beginner on that software I wouldn't judge harshly YET. Insert mode is IMO godlike and I can't without it. Several other options are really useful like "select more of the same event" although require you to remember what button combo is indeed frustrating since most Dorico functions again require 2 buttons like shift+key or alt+ key

Just have to get used to the workflow I guess. or maybe I had too high of an expectation since some people were really WOWED by Dorico so I was disappointed from not being WOWED but still a good software. I use it to notate my own piano pieces and also use it for my piano students to arrange simple songs/excersizes.
Post Reply

Return to “Yamaha Montage Forum”