The New Yamaha MODX

Covers the Yamaha MODX6, MODX7 and MODX8

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purcell
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Re: The New Yamaha MODX

Unread post by purcell » Tue Sep 11, 2018 1:34 am

The 70's are long gone! SY 77 ! ((i))
I have made a big mistake! By transferring the raging technology improvements of the mobile phone market to keyboard / synth developments.
Although we are in the 21st century, the synthesis of YAMAHA had its peak in 1970/1980.
To expect - that would be constant - to go on was wrong.
As Knolan has already described, I still feel confused about what YAMAHA, ROLAND and KORG nowadays offer for synths and workstations.
Knolan:
"Alas, it seems that for another generation at least, we'll have to tolerate this drivel from what was, for a long time, THE innovative company in synthesis."

THE innovative company in synthesis??? Where is it...or where did it go?

No matter! For + 1000 € there is the MODX?
Impossible to do something wrong.
You will not get more for +1000 € today. Hours of good music - homemade! ...in the long winter time!

Although? Could not that be different and much better?

The sensational show on Friday in NEW YORK is still exciting.
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Re: The New Yamaha MODX

Unread post by tommymandel » Tue Sep 11, 2018 4:10 am

Does anyone know the weight of this new Yamaha keyboard. And will it read Montage sounds?
Thank you.
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Re: The New Yamaha MODX

Unread post by Derek » Tue Sep 11, 2018 7:28 am

Saul wrote:
Tue Sep 11, 2018 12:27 am
Montage and I think the MODX do have a sequencer of sorts but I'll let Derek take this one as he owns a Montage and I have not had a hands-on with the MODX yet.
Hi

Montage has a performance sequence to capture your performances. There is not much in the way of editing capability. I think the intent is to do that in Cubase (or similar). That’s as much as know as I don’t use sequencers in synths. I do all of that in Cubase. I think the MODX has it as well.

So don’t expect a MOXF or Motif like sequence on the MODX. The heritage is from the Montage as a performance instrument.
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Re: The New Yamaha MODX

Unread post by Derek » Tue Sep 11, 2018 7:36 am

knolan wrote:
Tue Sep 11, 2018 1:02 am
I have to be honest - I find this release to be nothing short of depressing. If this is all that Yamaha can come up with after three years of Montage; it says to me they have made absolutely no changes in their philosophy since the dismantlement of their renowned synthesizer development capability of the 70's to the 90's.

It's Yamaha for God's sake. The company who gave the world the GX1, CS80, DX1, DX7, SY77 and VL1. And this is their response to the otherwise revolution in synthesis taking place with essentially every other manufacturer.

......
HI, Kevin

That is how I felt when I jumped ship to the Kronos in 2014, and when the Montage first came out. But I came to the conclusion last year that I can build my own multi engine synth from a combination of VSTis and the hardware I have.

Maybe that is part of the decision chain, that is slowing down innovation in the big vendors. And I also think the reality of it is that only a small percentage of keyboard players get beyond the presets so do not care how the sounds are made. I think that is the reality of the market that they play in.

It is not worth competing with the explosion of high quality VSTis (or boutique hardware if you still want hardware), and the focus is thus on a solid instrument that sounds great and has plenty of performance controls and features. I don’t know. But when I auditioned the Montage last year, i went in with a more open mind than I had had, I purchased it within 30 minutes of demoing time. It did everything I wanted as a live replacement for my EX5 (don’t fear, I retain an EX5R in the studio!), and it sounded great. Very SY like IMO. Despite lacking an AN engine, it can sound as analog as an SY.

I don’t diasgree with you, in that it is somewhat criminal to trade on that past heritage and not offer more innovation, but for now, I have a Kronos, a Montage, a Nord G2 engine and the means to play live my heavyweight VSTis like Omnisphere and UH-E DIVA. That is my dream rig, and where I think the future lies. Yamaha and Korg have given me too fine boards where, yes, we would love to see them go further, but as they stand they sound great have plenty of control surfaces for live use and I can keep expanding via VSTis as I choose. That is my model for the future....

E.g. last night I was messing about and suddenly came up with a great sounding idea, based on
  • A Montage Performance
  • A Kronos STR-1 sound under that performance, providing a little more weight
  • An Omisphere arpeggio also under that performance
  • A Kronos AL-1 lead (along with the Montage lead in the performance)
  • An AN1x sound (which I can replicate in UH-E Hive good enough for live use
  • MTRON Pro and the new “Streetly Tapes Vol 4” - Voice of NECAM (published with Steve Hackett’s blessing
There is no way I could get that out of one device - that dream Yamaha synth with all of their past tech in it. But with my rig, I can do all of this live, and this is my future model, and as mentioned above, I suspect similar thinking may be behind the slow down in significant innovation from the big three.
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Re: The New Yamaha MODX

Unread post by Saul » Tue Sep 11, 2018 9:50 am

tommymandel wrote:
Tue Sep 11, 2018 4:10 am
Does anyone know the weight of this new Yamaha keyboard. And will it read Montage sounds?
Thank you.
Hi Tommy, welcome to yamahamusicians.com :)

I can't say for sure what the weight of the MODX will be but using the Montage 6 as a guide, which weighs in at 15 kg (33 lbs., 1 oz.) I am totally confident it will be less than that and probably closer to the MOXF6 which was 7.1 kg. Perhaps somewhere between the two?
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Re: The New Yamaha MODX

Unread post by Saul » Tue Sep 11, 2018 9:51 am

pologuy wrote:
Tue Sep 11, 2018 1:19 am
We obviously don't know all of the particulars...

But from what I can see so far - it's basically 3/4 (maybe more...?) of a Montage - at less than half the price...

No...?
That pretty much sums it up. It is definitely a LOT of keyboard for the money :)
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Re: The New Yamaha MODX

Unread post by Saul » Tue Sep 11, 2018 10:01 am

knolan wrote:
Tue Sep 11, 2018 1:02 am
I have to be honest - I find this release to be nothing short of depressing. If this is all that Yamaha can come up with after three years of Montage; it says to me they have made absolutely no changes in their philosophy since the dismantlement of their renowned synthesizer development capability of the 70's to the 90's.

It's Yamaha for God's sake. The company who gave the world the GX1, CS80, DX1, DX7, SY77 and VL1. And this is their response to the otherwise revolution in synthesis taking place with essentially every other manufacturer.
You sound like me there Kholan :lol:

I must admit I have been pretty critical of Yamaha over the years and of course that didn't win me any friends up there at Yamaha HQ but this time I can honestly say I am totally on-board with what they have done in the MODX.

Yamaha are not trying to break new ground here. This is an evolutionary rather than revolutionary product. It takes AWM and FM into the 21st century. How many people out there actually used and exhausted the possibilities of the original mating of AWM & FM in the SY77/99 and EX?

Where are these revolutionary new forms of synthesis from ROLAND and KORG? Any examples? I'm not talking about the technicalities here. The end product is the important part. How is anything being done by anyone else really standing out from the crowd?

It's the law of diminishing returns in play here. We are at a point where really it doesn't matter what form of synthesis you use, the end result is pretty much the same. It is now about the music we create more than how we create it...or at least that is my take on it, that is not a definitive statement.

For me personally and I would guess the vast majority of people who buy a keyboard these days, I have absolutely no interest at all in "creating" sounds from scratch. Manipulating sounds yes, but creating them? Why? It is all out there already.

In creating the MODX Yamaha have ticked every box on my keyboard wish list and right now I can't ask for more than that...I don't "need" more than that.
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Re: The New Yamaha MODX

Unread post by Saul » Tue Sep 11, 2018 10:05 am

purcell wrote:
Tue Sep 11, 2018 1:34 am
The 70's are long gone! SY 77 ! ((i))
I have made a big mistake! By transferring the raging technology improvements of the mobile phone market to keyboard / synth developments.
Although we are in the 21st century, the synthesis of YAMAHA had its peak in 1970/1980.
To expect - that would be constant - to go on was wrong.
As Knolan has already described, I still feel confused about what YAMAHA, ROLAND and KORG nowadays offer for synths and workstations.
Knolan:
"Alas, it seems that for another generation at least, we'll have to tolerate this drivel from what was, for a long time, THE innovative company in synthesis."

THE innovative company in synthesis??? Where is it...or where did it go?

No matter! For + 1000 € there is the MODX?
Impossible to do something wrong.
You will not get more for +1000 € today. Hours of good music - homemade! ...in the long winter time!

Although? Could not that be different and much better?

The sensational show on Friday in NEW YORK is still exciting.
What is it you are expecting? I hear people talk about lack of innovation..and I was one of them by the way but, then I thought, what is it exactly that I am asking for? How many forms of synthesis do you need? How many unique sounds have you created with the synthesis methods already available to you?

We can all complain, it's very easy to do. But where are our solutions?

Yamaha have done exactly what I asked them to do two years ago. I can ask no more of them than that.
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Re: The New Yamaha MODX

Unread post by purcell » Tue Sep 11, 2018 3:12 pm

What do they give us? And what is in the market? YAMAHA,ROLAND,KORG

Does this correspond to the 21st century - the current technology - what we get?
Or are there still savings everywhere?

It's all very easy!

Your ears suddenly hear the 21st century! And you only scream! WOW !!!!!
I have been waiting for this effect for years.
I am positively surprised by CASIO. For 200-400 € there are good keyboards.

All in all, your ears will hear the difference! When the sound revolution is on the market.

Unfortunately, I still can not judge what they sell to us on keyboards?
Does this correspond to about 100% of the current possibilities / technology?
Or only 30%?

Are we currently getting much less? At the mobile phone market, I'm sure I'm up to date!
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Re: The New Yamaha MODX

Unread post by Saul » Tue Sep 11, 2018 3:59 pm

purcell wrote:
Tue Sep 11, 2018 3:12 pm
What do they give us? And what is in the market? YAMAHA,ROLAND,KORG

Does this correspond to the 21st century - the current technology - what we get?
Or are there still savings everywhere?

It's all very easy!

Your ears suddenly hear the 21st century! And you only scream! WOW !!!!!
I have been waiting for this effect for years.
I am positively surprised by CASIO. For 200-400 € there are good keyboards.

All in all, your ears will hear the difference! When the sound revolution is on the market.

Unfortunately, I still can not judge what they sell to us on keyboards?
Does this correspond to about 100% of the current possibilities / technology?
Or only 30%?

Are we currently getting much less? At the mobile phone market, I'm sure I'm up to date!
You have not yet told us what it is you want? Human hearing can only detect so much in a sound. We have gone past those limits a long time ago. Where else is there to go with sound quality? What are these incredible new synthesis methods your talking about?

All that is happening now is technology enables us to have features and sound quality that were previously reserved for the top end keyboards but for a much lower price. Casio have given us what would have previously been considered "entry level" keyboards but with sound quality that surpasses anything that went before at this price point.

If someone can tell me exactly what it is you are expecting for £1000 and that Yamaha are not giving us I would be very happy to hear it?
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Re: The New Yamaha MODX

Unread post by purcell » Tue Sep 11, 2018 4:44 pm

What I want? Fasten your seatbelt now!

All the original instruments I know ... sound a lot! better than their imitations.
The RHODES, the STEINWAY, etc. + a lot of electronic instruments, synths.

It´s not the point, to buy them as VSTs!

Forget about +/- 1000 €! Let it cost 2000 - 5000 €.

I don´t think you can do this "quality step" with the old AWM 2 or FM!

But of course! With these amounts of data, it probably just has to be a VST. Nowadays.

It is about a new computer system, sound system with extreme efficiency and lightning fast processing and implementation,
to reproduce such complex sound structures "Steinway piano".

This also applies to all the other instruments and music in general.
Reproductions of instruments and music 30,50,70 or expensive!... 100 %.
Of course, this will be expensive, but I'm sure: is this already possible? ... or in the future, for sure!

Incidentally, this refers to the whole theme of "sound production and quality".

So! Are we up to date today? What's up with these YAMAHA, ROLAND and KORG?
Or do we always get old (ancient?) things in a new package. Ongoing.
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Re: The New Yamaha MODX

Unread post by Derek » Tue Sep 11, 2018 8:27 pm

Not sure if this is already covered above, but here is a link to a forthcoming Yamaha Live Stream Event
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Re: The New Yamaha MODX

Unread post by Saul » Tue Sep 11, 2018 9:06 pm

Derek wrote:
Tue Sep 11, 2018 8:27 pm
Not sure if this is already covered above, but here is a link to a forthcoming Yamaha Live Stream Event
Got it on the front of the site. Very much looking forward to that :)

https://yamahamusicians.com/special-yam ... ight-time/
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Re: The New Yamaha MODX

Unread post by Saul » Tue Sep 11, 2018 9:12 pm

purcell wrote:
Tue Sep 11, 2018 4:44 pm
What I want? Fasten your seatbelt now!

All the original instruments I know ... sound a lot! better than their imitations.
The RHODES, the STEINWAY, etc. + a lot of electronic instruments, synths.

It´s not the point, to buy them as VSTs!

Forget about +/- 1000 €! Let it cost 2000 - 5000 €.

I don´t think you can do this "quality step" with the old AWM 2 or FM!

But of course! With these amounts of data, it probably just has to be a VST. Nowadays.

It is about a new computer system, sound system with extreme efficiency and lightning fast processing and implementation,
to reproduce such complex sound structures "Steinway piano".

This also applies to all the other instruments and music in general.
Reproductions of instruments and music 30,50,70 or expensive!... 100 %.
Of course, this will be expensive, but I'm sure: is this already possible? ... or in the future, for sure!

Incidentally, this refers to the whole theme of "sound production and quality".

So! Are we up to date today? What's up with these YAMAHA, ROLAND and KORG?
Or do we always get old (ancient?) things in a new package. Ongoing.
We have been here before. Yamaha, Roland, Korg etc "could" give you that perfect simile of a Rhodes, Steinway etc but it would cost a fortune using todays tech, or certainly more than most people would be prepared to pay anyway. So, no one is holding out on you it is just that a keyboard like that would be economically unsustainable at this time.

The acoustic representations of pianos in keyboards like Montage, Roland FA/DS and Korg's Kronos are absolutely fine for me and my needs. If I had a huge house and a very large bank balance I would certainly buy a Bosendorfer, Bechstein or Yamaha S7X but that may have to wait just a little wile yet ;)

I am very happy with the plethora of options we have available to us right now (Y)
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Re: The New Yamaha MODX

Unread post by Derek » Tue Sep 11, 2018 9:35 pm

The facsimiles are in modelled synths like the Kronos or any VSTi you care to pick to match your need.
Want a monster analog synth? UH-E DIVA
Want a Hammond Organ? VB3
Want a good resource light acoustic/electirc piano emulation? Pianoteq (endorsed by Steinway, it's that good)
Want a Mellotron clone? MTRON PRO
Etc.

And they are getting as good as the originals. Drop them in a mix and few people would spot the difference. You are also getting the point where the argument is who's classic instrument sounds right compared to an emulation? One man's Minmoog can sound different to somebody else's due to calibration and component tolerances.

But we've been here before....
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