Yamaha MODX Wishlist - Suggestions For Future Updates

Covers the Yamaha MODX6, MODX7 and MODX8

Moderators: Derek, parametric, Saul

United States of America
DenBro88
Member
Member
Posts: 34
Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2018 6:32 pm

Re: Yamaha MODX Wishlist - Suggestions For Future Updates

Unread post by DenBro88 » Fri Nov 02, 2018 3:49 pm

Hi again Saul,

Another one for the wish list: being able to sort Performances in the Live Set area by name. You can do this in the Performance Category Search area but not in the Live Set area.

You can manually rearrange Performances in the Live Set area (by pressing Edit and then using the Swap button in the lower right corner) to be in any order you want, but this can easily become tedious and time consuming if you have many pages of Live Set Banks.

Dennis
United States of America
DenBro88
Member
Member
Posts: 34
Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2018 6:32 pm

Re: Yamaha MODX Wishlist - Suggestions For Future Updates

Unread post by DenBro88 » Sat Nov 03, 2018 4:35 pm

Hi Saul,

Would this be the proper thread to report what appears to be a minor bug? I'll describe it, and then perhaps you can decide if it belongs here or elsewhere:

In the Live Set area if you use the Swap function to move a Performance into an empty slot, the original location of that Performance becomes empty. This works if you are moving the Performance to an empty slot on the current Page OR to any other Page in that Bank. That makes sense and seems like the way it should work.

What I found was that if you selected another Bank and then did the Swap, the Performance would appear in the new blank slot but it also remained in the original slot. In other words, Swap works like Copy when you go to another Bank.

That doesn't seem right, does it?

Dennis
User avatar Denmark
n0rby
Posts: 1
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2018 5:36 pm

Better distortion effect MORE than required

Unread post by n0rby » Sat Nov 03, 2018 5:46 pm

Having used Yamaha Motif's for many years and now MODX, there is one thing which was never great and that is Yamaha's distortion algoritm. It makes all the tone wheel organs sound weak, the electric guitars awfull and some synth sounds just boring.

Please buy a better distortion algorithm and implement it in an upgrade!!
:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

I am sayng this as a long time advocate for, and user of yamaha. Compare to Nord or even checp organ clones and you'll know what I mean.
User avatar Germany
TotoFan
Member
Member
Posts: 16
Joined: Thu Nov 01, 2018 11:48 pm

Re: Yamaha MODX Wishlist - Suggestions For Future Updates

Unread post by TotoFan » Sun Nov 04, 2018 10:21 pm

Anybody know if there is a good reason for the key pitch being limited to two octaves (+/- 24) ? I usually store in a performance some part from percussion sounds like hand clap, finger snap or other and assign them to the higher note on the keybed. I know I could make a custom drum assignment performance, but is a bit annoying and would be faster to just transpose to the right "note"..
Australia
pax-eterna
Member
Member
Posts: 204
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2018 10:25 pm

Re: Yamaha MODX Wishlist - Suggestions For Future Updates

Unread post by pax-eterna » Sun Nov 04, 2018 11:36 pm

It's a Yamaha thing!
Canada
vertig0spin
Member
Member
Posts: 105
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:15 am

Re: Yamaha MODX Wishlist - Suggestions For Future Updates

Unread post by vertig0spin » Mon Nov 05, 2018 6:30 am

I kinda said this already in a previous Wishlist suggestion; however after finally having had the opportunity (unexpectedly) to try the Montage 8 this past weekend, I will revise and say this suggestion with more specificity (and this modification should easily be a doable one since it only involves software revisions, not physical changes):

For the MODX8, please provide a 'New' global configuration setting called "BHE Emulation" that can be selected whereby at the software level, it changes how the MODX responds to the various GHS keybed velocity layer triggering attack levels for each key across the entire keyboard, so that it offsets the GHS keybed's graduated hammer action and emulates the triggering of the same velocity layers as the Montage 8 BHE keybed does when using the same exact amount of force striking the various keys. This is most useful and prevalent when playing sample based 'piano' sounds.

After previously only having played the MODX8 synth over the past month or so, and realizing that it didn't sound & feel like a real piano when playing piano performances with how hard I hit the keys from 'roughly' around the C5 note and lower (increasingly), I finally was able to try the Montage 8 BHE based synth this past Saturday, and it felt & sounded "exactly" like playing a real acoustic piano across the entire keyboard, and not just on the highest notes like with the MODX8. This video is perfectly right on point from the very start up to the 1:06 mark (basically just comparing the same piano samples), whereby you will hear a difference in both volume & velocity layers being triggered for the same amount of force hitting the keys, except in the highest keys. They are basically identical until the point whereby he hits the C5 notes & lower on both keyboards around the 0:25 mark. He is not hitting the keys on the MODX8 more softly, but rather the MODX keybed is not triggering the velocity sample layers properly, as they were designed for a more balanced keybed like the Montage has.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ob4o2xEH6Y

I can't now play piano on the MODX8, let alone purchase that synth, unless/until this new option is available, and It is now 'for me' a complete deal breaker!!
If you are keyboard player who plays with any sounds/styles except pianos(or piano is just not a big deal), this may not be an issue at all, and the MODX may be the perfect keyboard for you.
If you are more primarily a piano player type keyboardist, who may also play synths/organs/etc., then you will most likely notice that the MODX8 doesn't feel or sound right when playing piano.
I've watched a lot of videos of the Korg Kronos 88 pianos, the Yamaha Montage 8, and the MODX8 pianos over the past Month+, and I have not once heard either the Kronos nor the Montage have issues with attack in the lower/mid range keys (anything from C5 down), but I have in several videos heard the MODX8 have issues with too low of a velocity layer being trigger in this area of the keybed.
Now I can confidently say that I have tried both the MODX8 & Montage8, and without a doubt, I can confirm this flaw in the MODX8 to be true for sample based pianos!!

So Yamaha, please provide a global configuration setting called "BHE Emulation". Korg is a solid tough competitor. Something like this could help tip the scales on the lower end models and even cause some to go with the MODX8 over a Korg Kronos 88...

PS. If you really want to compete with the Korg's Kronos, and make both these Yamaha's a more viable option, then just add another software based tweak...make the C7 Grand Pianos from the Genos available as a library for the Montage & MODX synths, especially for all the Pop and Rock based keyboardists!!!
User avatar Netherlands
Xander
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Nov 05, 2018 12:07 pm

Re: Yamaha MODX Wishlist - Suggestions For Future Updates

Unread post by Xander » Mon Nov 05, 2018 12:33 pm

I'm ordering my MODX8 today. It's the first synth that I see as a possible successor for my S90ES's. The Motif & Montage 8 models were way too big, to take on the road.

And that's where my first wish comes from:

A solid, reliable, pro-quality MODX8, the "S90DX"
I would love to see a S90DX come now & I see a huge market for it, that Yamaha lost when releasing the S90XS, with it's horrible user interface.
-with the same features as the MODX
-similar layout, with the pitchbend and modulation wheel placed above the keyboard
-more solid materials, knobs, etc. The reliability of the S90ES & Montage.
-have extra samples pre-installed: the Bosendorfer and other extra samples that are piano, rhodes, wurlitzer, or even a piano that's unique to the S90DX, like that S90Es had and what was the foundation for its success

And my 2nd wish:
An expandable Montage/MODX!
How great it would be it Yamaha goes back to their great VA modelings and have card slots in the MODX/Montage for synth-cards, similar to the PLG cards! The PLG150-AN is still such a great sounding board. It's the reason for me having 3 Yamaha CS6x's, each with 2 boards in it. The PLG150-VL is also an incredible board.

2 wishes, even before I have the MODX8 here. Maybe then more will come, lol.
-Xander
Canada
vertig0spin
Member
Member
Posts: 105
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:15 am

Re: Yamaha MODX Wishlist - Suggestions For Future Updates

Unread post by vertig0spin » Tue Nov 06, 2018 2:51 am

Please release a new library of Genos sounds for the Montage & MODX that includes the 'C7 Grand Pianos' (especially for Pop/Rock), and some other great patches that are not currently available on the Montage/MODX!

Edit: This just became more of a 'nice to have'. I still think it would be smart for Yamaha to make this a free library for the Montage/MODX in order to take on & compete with the variety of great pianos that the Korg Kronos/Krome have; however I just came across this video at the very bottom of their page, and at first listen of the video, it may even be better than the Genos C7 pianos (I'll have to investigate more).
I had heard the demos of the "K-Sounds Epic Grand - C7 Piano" several times on their page https://www.yamahamusicsoft.com/synth/e ... nd-montage but the demos didn't really do it justice. They really should have this video at the top of the page instead, because it puts the Montage/MODX's variety of awesome pianos sounds up there with the Kronos IMHO:

User avatar United States of America
dfahrner
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Oct 15, 2018 5:32 pm

Re: Yamaha MODX Wishlist - Suggestions For Future Updates

Unread post by dfahrner » Tue Nov 06, 2018 8:18 pm

vertig0spin wrote:
Mon Nov 05, 2018 6:30 am
For the MODX8, please provide a 'New' global configuration setting called "BHE Emulation" that can be selected whereby at the software level, it changes how the MODX responds to the various GHS keybed velocity layer triggering attack levels for each key across the entire keyboard, so that it offsets the GHS keybed's graduated hammer action and emulates the triggering of the same velocity layers as the Montage 8 BHE keybed does when using the same exact amount of force striking the various keys...this video is perfectly right on point from the very start up to the 1:06 mark (basically just comparing the same piano samples), whereby you will hear a difference in both volume & velocity layers being triggered for the same amount of force hitting the keys, except in the highest keys. They are basically identical until the point whereby he hits the C5 notes & lower on both keyboards around the 0:25 mark. He is not hitting the keys on the MODX8 more softly, but rather the MODX keybed is not triggering the velocity sample layers properly, as they were designed for a more balanced keybed like the Montage has.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ob4o2xEH6Y
In Edit mode, you can adjust the velocities at which the various layers trigger, and each layer's volume, and this will change how the piano sounds and responds in relation to playing force (and the more complex pianos like the CFX and Bosendorfer have a LOT of levels you can adjust)...I don't think that you can tell from this video how hard he's striking the keys; the GHS action is lighter than the Montage's BHE keybed action; the general volume levels of the two instruments seem to be different (the player is farther away from the speakers when the Montage is played, so maybe the volume was the same for him); etc., etc...so there are a of (fairly subtle) differences here, and I'm pretty sure that you could get the MODX GHS keybed to respond the way you want it to with some element range / level tweaking...and of course everybody has a different idea about how a piano should respond, so it's doubtful that any factory enhancement could satisfy everyone...

df
Canada
vertig0spin
Member
Member
Posts: 105
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:15 am

Re: Yamaha MODX Wishlist - Suggestions For Future Updates

Unread post by vertig0spin » Tue Nov 06, 2018 9:10 pm

dfahrner wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 8:18 pm
In Edit mode, you can adjust the velocities at which the various layers trigger, and each layer's volume, and this will change how the piano sounds and responds in relation to playing force (and the more complex pianos like the CFX and Bosendorfer have a LOT of levels you can adjust)...I don't think that you can tell from this video how hard he's striking the keys; the GHS action is lighter than the Montage's BHE keybed action; the general volume levels of the two instruments seem to be different (the player is farther away from the speakers when the Montage is played, so maybe the volume was the same for him); etc., etc...so there are a of (fairly subtle) differences here, and I'm pretty sure that you could get the MODX GHS keybed to respond the way you want it to with some element range / level tweaking...and of course everybody has a different idea about how a piano should respond, so it's doubtful that any factory enhancement could satisfy everyone...
df
I've played both the MODX8 & Montage8, and that video just confirms what I experienced in playing the two keyboards. The MODX8 is equally as loud and hits the same higher velocities as the Montage 8 on the keys above the C5 mark. They are nearly identical there when I played them both. If you listen to just the part of the video at the beginning where he hits the higher keys (just before he hits the C5 keys on both), they both have the same volume and attack velocity triggered. As soon as he hits the C5 key and all keys below it, the volume and attack velocities change on the MODX8, and are gradually lower in both volume and velocity layer. This is exactly what I experienced playing the MODX8 pianos. And in contrast, the Montage8 pianos were perfectly even & balanced across the entire keybed when I played it this past Saturday. It felt and sounded exactly like playing an expensive grand piano if I closed my eyes, whereas the MODX8 didn't.

Because the velocity layers and volume gradually go down as you play down the keybed on the MODX8, there is no possible way to truly fix the keybed issue with the current software on the MODX, because that is how the GHS keybed was designed, and since the MODX8 can't do Velocity 'Scaling' to counter the GHS scaling, any changes in Velocity Depth, Curve or Offset, affect the entire keyboard equally. So when I played the MODX8 and set the velocity curve to 'Soft', the lower/mid keys were much better, but then the higher keys gradually were too loud & hitting to high a velocity layer. You'd have no problem hitting 127 on the highest keys with a Soft Velocity curve on the MODX8...
GHS is an extremely poor design IMHO, because they are designed for synths/digital pianos, but yet the way the various samples(layers) are created on sample based pianos, they are best to be played on even/balanced keybeds.

I think it is entirely possible to fix the problem at the software level on the MODX8 so that it plays pianos nearly identically to the Montage8. The only way the problem can be fixed is if they add Velocity Scaling or some new setting that counteracts the GHS keybed so that it plays the same velocity layers & volumes for the same amount of force across all keys of the keyboard.

Although Stevie18 did have a pretty decent suggestion for Pianos that have 1 part, whereby you copy that part to parts 2 and 3, split the 3 parts up into using 3 different sections of the keyboard, and adjust each one to fit better. Basically, leave the highest keys as there are and adjust the lower 2 parts (sections) to have higher velocities using Velocity Depth, Curve &/or Offset settings. It wouldn't be perfectly even, but would be much better than the way it currently is on the MODX8. Read his post here: viewtopic.php?f=186&t=11774&start=75#p70914
User avatar United States of America
dfahrner
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Oct 15, 2018 5:32 pm

Re: Yamaha MODX Wishlist - Suggestions For Future Updates

Unread post by dfahrner » Wed Nov 07, 2018 4:56 am

vertig0spin: I didn't see your earlier postings on the MODX8 GHS keybed (in the "MODX - Make or Break" thread), and I think anotherscott and Stevie18 answered your concerns there a lot more thoroughly than I can (I only got my MODX7 last week)...the bottom line is that there are a lot of adjustments you can make to the MODX piano programs (at all levels: performance, part, and/or element) to get the GHS keybed to respond the way you want...if you don't want to put the time into doing this, I can understand that (it does take a lot of time), and the MODX is probably not for you...it's unlikely that any change that Yamaha would come up with will satisfy you, since everyone has a different, very subjective opinion about how a piano keybed should respond...Yamaha has already tried to make the MODX pianos appeal to the majority of customers / potential customers, and to judge from most comments on the forums, they have succeeded...but hey, what are wishlists for?...

df
Canada
vertig0spin
Member
Member
Posts: 105
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:15 am

Re: Yamaha MODX Wishlist - Suggestions For Future Updates

Unread post by vertig0spin » Wed Nov 07, 2018 5:47 pm

dfahrner wrote:
Wed Nov 07, 2018 4:56 am
vertig0spin: I didn't see your earlier postings on the MODX8 GHS keybed (in the "MODX - Make or Break" thread), and I think anotherscott and Stevie18 answered your concerns there a lot more thoroughly than I can (I only got my MODX7 last week)...the bottom line is that there are a lot of adjustments you can make to the MODX piano programs (at all levels: performance, part, and/or element) to get the GHS keybed to respond the way you want...if you don't want to put the time into doing this, I can understand that (it does take a lot of time), and the MODX is probably not for you...it's unlikely that any change that Yamaha would come up with will satisfy you, since everyone has a different, very subjective opinion about how a piano keybed should respond...Yamaha has already tried to make the MODX pianos appeal to the majority of customers / potential customers, and to judge from most comments on the forums, they have succeeded...but hey, what are wishlists for?...
df

You actually wouldn't notice this issue on the MODX7 and with your particular keyboard version you can easily correct any velocity issues because yours is an evenly balanced keybed. The MODX6 & 7 are not what I am referring to. My suggestion to Yamaha is specific to the MODX8 only, which has the GHS keybed. I don't know if you tried the MODX8 for piano and then the Montage8, but if you had, I would expect you might notice the issue somewhat on the MODX8 while playing pianos. I would prefer the MODX7 over the MODX8 at this point! (Unless my wish came true of course...)

Here's to hoping!! :wink:
User avatar United States of America
Richever
Posts: 6
Joined: Sat Nov 10, 2018 6:57 pm

Re: Yamaha MODX Wishlist - Suggestions For Future Updates

Unread post by Richever » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:19 pm

I really like all of the suggestions I have seen on this list. I would like to see that when muting a part, the midi transmit would also be muted, enabling it to be saved to a Scene. Another possible way of doing this (and something that has been suggested elsewhere) would be if Keyboard Control could be saved to a Scene.
User avatar Italy
wizeutropio
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2018 12:56 pm

Re: Yamaha MODX Wishlist - Suggestions For Future Updates

Unread post by wizeutropio » Thu Nov 15, 2018 12:59 pm

I'd like to have via a (future) software update the possibility to have Cross-fade performances besides the classic Split and Layer options... something similar to the new Nord keyboards...
User avatar Ireland
Saul
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 10825
Joined: Sun Feb 01, 2004 1:00 am
Contact:

Re: Yamaha MODX Wishlist - Suggestions For Future Updates

Unread post by Saul » Thu Nov 15, 2018 2:23 pm

wizeutropio wrote:
Thu Nov 15, 2018 12:59 pm
I'd like to have via a (future) software update the possibility to have Cross-fade performances besides the classic Split and Layer options... something similar to the new Nord keyboards...
I like that idea (Y)
Saul
Site Admin
Subscribe To Our YouTube Channel!
Review Yamahamusicians.com on Trustpilot
Sign up to the Newsletter
Follow us on Twitter @YamahaMusicians
Follow Us On Facebook
Dowina Acoustic Guitars: Dowina Cabernet DC
Dowina Chardonnay GAC DS - Dowina Rustica GAC - Dowina Marus - Dowina Puella

Yamaha FS-TA/Vintage VE2000GG Gordon Giltrap/Ibanez AE245/Arturia Keylab 61 MKII/Arturia Analog Lab 3/Arturia Piano V2/Pianoteq 6 Pro/Apple iMac 27"/Logic Pro X/Ableton Live 10/Behringer QX1202USB Mixer/Presonus Eris 4.5 Active Monitors
Post Reply

Return to “Yamaha MODX Forum”