New Korg Nautilus

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Derek
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New Korg Nautilus

Unread post by Derek »

This popped into my inbox today

Looks like a derivative of the Kronos.

Despite the Kronos being a very old design now (itself derived from OASYS), so Korg could be accused of milking this architecture as much as they can, it still sounds excellent and you get nine sound engines not the two of the Montage/MODX. However, the price differential between Kronos and Nautilus is not that great, so it can hardly be seen as a lower entry point version of the Kronos in the same way that the MODX is compared to the Montage.

E.g. A MODX7 is about 45% of the price of a Montage 7, but the Nautilus is still around 80% of the price of the equivalent Kronos, but you lose most of the control surface (including the Vector joystick), Karma, aftertouch, etc. Personally for that differential, I would still go the extra for a Kronos. I can only assume the Kronos is going to be retired now and this is the replacement. Will be interesting to see if stock of the Kronos now starts drying up.

But it may be of interest to some.



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Re: New Korg Nautilus

Unread post by Saul »

Hard to say much going on the VERY limited demo but, this seems to be 'Kronos Lite'?

I don't think it has a hope in hells chance of tempting MODX buyers. The price difference is HUGE!

It seems to be pitched more at the Montage buyer, well in terms of price at least.

I know 9 synth engines seem like a really good deal but AWM2 and FM-X is a very powerful combi.

I can't see existing Kronos owners being interested either. And if I were in the market for a keyboard of that calibre I would be looking for a used Kronos rather than a cut-down version which the Nautiuls appears to be.

I just cannot believe there is no aftertouch on a keyboard at this price point :think:


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Re: New Korg Nautilus

Unread post by parametric »

Saul wrote: Mon Nov 09, 2020 11:29 pm I just cannot believe there is no aftertouch on a keyboard at this price point :think:
Neither can I. Its a "progressive" control that can be used to GREAT effect - WHILE you get on with the business of

PLAYING the instrument.

Its amazing to me that, considering these instruments are for sale to Musicians This seem to CONFIRM that there are no

musicians on the design team?

Having some would prevent major Gaffs like this . . . . . :roll:

I for one would dismiss it out of hand for this omission.

The Fusion naturally, has AT . . . . :think: :roll:

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Re: New Korg Nautilus

Unread post by Saul »

I wonder, has KORG actually said anything about who this keyboard is aimed at and WHY there is no aftertouch?

The Fusion has AT and even taking account of inflation the 8HD which was originally priced at I think £1500 back in 2005? would be around £2300 in today's money. I think the 6HD eventually came down to £995 or thereabouts. So £1542 at 2020 prices.

I know the Nautilus has 9 synth engines but I would happily trade a couple for the aftertouch.

So what is happening here? We seem to get less for more money every year. :angry-tappingfoot:


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Re: New Korg Nautilus

Unread post by Derek »

I agree.

When the message first dropped in my inbox, I assumed that the Nautilus would be at the MODX price point as a cut down sibling to the Kronos. SO I was quite shocked when I saw the price last night. I can't work it out.

It is not a MODX competitor. It is not a full Kronos replacement either as it loses so much. I can only think that either Korg have decided few people want the extra features of the Kronos and it is is the new Kronos at a slightly lower price point, or it is a sub Kronos and there is a new, more powerful flag ship in the wings at a higher price point as the Kronos replacement.

Whether or not 9 synth engines means much to you or not, depends on what you are after of course. e.g. the CX3 Hammond organ engine is over a decade old (it was in the original OASYS), but it still blows any Hammond patch from the Montage/MODX out of the water, as it is a model of the organ and all of those subtle nuances, not a collection of static samples. The SGX engine still does better acoustic pianos than the Montage to these ears, as you have unlooped, uncompressed samples with sympathetic string resonance, streamed from SDD. The EP sounds are far better. STR-1 and MOD-7 have loads of unexplored potential still, and then you have three analog VAs (AL-1, POLY6 and MS20) before you get to good old HD-1 sample and synthetics (with uncompressed samples streamed from SDD) with wave sequencing.

So, personally, I would not dismiss the power and versatility that is still there. How you control it with no control surface, vector joystick or after-touch is what mystifies me, unless you add a control surface yourself. Maybe Korg figure that is what people will do, and it is easy if it is class compliant.

And on the plus side it means my six year old Kronos is still top of the Korg pile (for now)


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Re: New Korg Nautilus

Unread post by vertig0spin »

This can only be good for people who own a MODX or Montage, because I predict that we will see Yamaha's response to this new Korg Hardware release via a new OS update within 1 month from now (more likely a couple of weeks) that will contain enticing new features/enhancements for both MODX/Montage. Perfect timing for Yamaha to add a new VA Engine, effects, sequencer enhancements, possibly the C7 piano library, etc...just in time for the holiday season!

It's hard to tell what Korg is trying to compete with as this keyboard seems kinda like a MODX, but the price is not competitive with the MODX, and if it's geared toward competing with the Montage, then I think it is lacking some major things that even Korg Kronos fans would not be happy with such as:
No Karma?
No Aftertouch?
No Sliders?

Regardless, this can't be bad for Yamaha or Montage/MODX owners, as it is far more cost effective for Yamaha to give us a new enhanced Montage/MODX Synth without any changes to the hardware, and at the same time gain an even greater customer base by telling new perspective buyers, especially those sitting on the fence, that the MODX/Montage are both continuing to give you more and more and more! :wink:


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Re: New Korg Nautilus

Unread post by jamesngo »

Hi guys,

I've just dropped at the Korg Dealer.
The new Korg Nautilus is comming out with a lot of sounds. If you have a good time you may go check out. There are heap sounds lists, specially Piano, EP, Guitars, Organ and World. I think Kronos does not have much sounds like Nautilus. The Nautilus owns the Master volume slider which nostalgia/ remind us about Korg M1 or Korg Wavestation. About the price, it's only cheaper than the current Kronos for about $500 - $700. But I think Korg will release next keyboard soon just after this Nautilus. Kronos is less sounds than any rival keyboards like Kurzweil PC3, PC4, Yamaha Monstage (sorry even Yamaha MODX has much sound presets than the Kronos).

In my opinion, Nautilus is out this moment is a preparation for next Korg flagship.


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Re: New Korg Nautilus

Unread post by Saul »

Having thousands of presets does not mean it is a good keyboard. How many pianos do you need? And will you play and use ALL of those presets :think: I know I wouldn't.

I have no doubt that the Nautilus IS a good keyboard. KORG tend not to put out anything of inferior quality but, it just seems from my perspective that the features to price ratio are off here?

I can buy a used KRONOS for less than the price of a new Nautilus and the KRONOS IS still most definitely the better keyboard.


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Re: New Korg Nautilus

Unread post by Derek »

Cannot agree more with that final point. I do not understand the price rationale given what you can buy a new Kronos for, let alone a second hand one. But there must be a rationale behind it.....


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Re: New Korg Nautilus

Unread post by Saul »

Another video from KORG showing the Nautilus in action.

I really like the pianos but I still don't like the price!



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Re: New Korg Nautilus

Unread post by Derek »

The Kronos (and now Nautilus) SGX-2 piano model has always sounded superb because, as I mentioned above, it used uncompressed and unlooped samples streamed from the SSD (compared to looped and compressed samples in the Montage), with sympathetic string resonance, which makes a heck of a difference to the overall sound. Between the Kronos and the Montage the Kronos still gives me my favourite piano sounds out of a keyboard, and they are way better than what I get out of a Montage. Heck my favourite Yamaha piano sound is still in the EX5.

But a far cheaper option is the all new Pianoteq 7 (just announced today), which I have just paid €29 to upgrade from V6 to V7

The video is a great show case of the new instrument (forget the price for a minute), and Kronos/OASYS heritage in general. Sounds like some sound engines have been expanded with more models in EP-1 (hope they make their way to the Kronos). And it confirmed that whilst Karma has been dropped (absolute madness, as it is so versatile), Wave sequencing is still present and correct in HD-1.

All in all a great demo, that show cases what it can do. I loved his "I want to break free" combi demo towards the end. Interestingly, in the video, after the demonstrator played a bit of Genesis and Turn it on Again (which sounded nothing like the ARP Quadra it was originally done on, but still good) around 15:00, I am convinced I heard at 15:14 him playing a bit of Tony Banks (the intro chords to "Big man", I think, from "Bankstatement"), so hats off to somebody who knows his Banks - whose solo albums are criminally underrated in my book!

I still do not like the control streamlining and loss of features, but you can only assume Korg have done their market research correctly (they usually do). Lack of aftertouch is a deal breaker for me on a keyboard of this price. E.g. I was noodling with a Vangelis type idea on the Montage tonight, I had one hand on the Montage for the CS80 and one hand on the Kronos (SGX-2 piano) and no hands free for a mod-wheel, so I was using after-touch to add modulation to the CS80 patch when I wanted it.

Some people will accuse Korg of resting on their laurels for too long, after all the tech is from the original OASYS keyboard that was released 15 years ago, and the Kronos came out on 2011, so is itself 9 years old now, and itself based on the OASYS in a cut down and cheaper hardware package and adding more engines. But it still sounds awesome, and most people don't care how the sounds are made.

The general consensus on Korg Forums is that this is a Kronos replacement, and Kronos will be withdrawn shortly, but the Nautilus will not be replacing my Kronos X 61.


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Re: New Korg Nautilus

Unread post by vertig0spin »

I wonder, were there any improvements in Processing/Polyphony with this new keyboard? That could set it apart from the Kronos a bit...
It was a huge, if not THE deciding factor for why I went with the Montage over the Kronos!

I have to also agree though about lack of Aftertouch for that price...it's a must for me to use Aftertouch
If you are going to use a cheaper keybed that is not capable of aftertouch, then the price should reflex this. Not saying it should be priced the same as the MODX, but if they came closer, it would make people second guess their choice in buying the MODX over this new keyboard...at this price I don't think many will second guess anything


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Re: New Korg Nautilus

Unread post by vertig0spin »

As per my prediction above, I am now seeing the same exact indicators that also led me to a prior prediction coming true for the OS update 3.0 on the Montage (2.0 on MODX), whereby we got the 'KBD CTRL' in Scenes and other functionality.

My Spidey senses are now tingling in high gear, because someone at Yamaha who is on the 'voicing team' & always available is currently not home. This lines up the same as when the Roland Fantom came out and then it wasn't long before we received the OS Update(s) I mentioned above! :wink:


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Re: New Korg Nautilus

Unread post by JGrissom2020 »

Unfortunately the reason I got my Montage 8 in 2017 was because (as a Guitar Center employee) and still very much involved with all things keyboards, Korg seems to have gone the way the Kurzweil did in the late 90s. Remember that Kurzweil K-series were seen as the defined and Upper-end workstations on the market. However, the pricepoint was usually way higher than anything Roland, Korg or Yamaha were going to- or wanting to contend with.
When Roland first put a USB port on their workstations, Korg, then Yamaha followed. Kurzweil did not. Despite having one of the best Firmware systems, the VAST. They moved away from K-series and has not been the same since.

Rolands FA-series (not quite a real solid Fantom replacement) put USB/Audio-MIDI on their FA series and it was not a perfected system (not a real audio interface included under the hood). It had its bugs- but worked with some of the DAWS. Now- Montage gets released Fall 2016 and sets the -THE BAR on that. Includes a real (Steinberg partnered) USB/MIDI-Audio interface under the hood, with a side program that shows a display communicating with a DAW? And paired with Cubase? In 30 mins I was up and running.

I had a Kronos- loved the sounds, and the ability to create some of the wildest tones ever, but when it came to truly seamless integration? Not at all. And now this Nautilus hits the market. And no lesson learned from the 2019 updated Fantom? Or the OS updates to Montage/MODX? Its Kronos lite and while I am delighted they updated (some) of the sound categorizations, and have new sounds- but I looked at the voice name list and I can see whats new. The same Combi/Program menu sound management that started with the M1 in 1989. That has been used on every workstation. All of them. I commend the company for seeing the need for Kronos lite. I commend the build quality and the attention to detail.

But still very much lacking behind Roland and Yamaha in the seamless integration category. An FS ARP 2600 reissue and Opsix, and event he Wavestate do not make up for the lack of a USB/Audio- MIDI component under the hood, when competitors are doing it.


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