Noise over Clavinova AUX in

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Re: Noise over Clavinova AUX in

Unread post by Saul » Thu Jan 18, 2018 11:15 am

Those are ferrite coils and yes they would normally remove "interference" from extraneous signals but they won't remove noise generated along the signal path i.e if you have a device with a noisy output generated by a fault within that device, that noise will still get through.

It's increasingly looking like there is a fault further along the chain somewhere. Faulty capacitor perhaps? not always obvious just from a visual inspection. Or some other component failure.

What we really need is someone with the same keyboard to try their inputs and see if they get the same results.
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Re: Noise over Clavinova AUX in

Unread post by clavifan » Fri Jan 19, 2018 6:11 pm

Today I removed again the plastic box with inputs and outputs. I made a "bridge" to test the RCA input taking the sound output on the 2x7 connector (see my last picture days ago).

It seems that all is OK in this part because the source and the output I made through this part sound good.

The next step is take off one metallic "case" from the centre of the Clavinova, because this sound cables goes to this part.
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Re: Noise over Clavinova AUX in

Unread post by Saul » Fri Jan 19, 2018 6:32 pm

Thanks for the update. It's a shame you are having to go to all this trouble but very interested to hear what you find.
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Re: Noise over Clavinova AUX in

Unread post by clavifan » Fri Jan 19, 2018 7:41 pm

Thanks Saul,
New info. I take off one little board, I think is the board of the amplifier, because all the inputs/headphones/etc... connectors are here.

When disconnect headphones cable from this motherboard, then no noise and no sound in the speakers. Why? I think all is a "serial wiring"? I can't explain better.

In the picture, red circle is this supposed headphone connector. and the green circle the Aux/output connector.
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Re: Noise over Clavinova AUX in

Unread post by clavifan » Fri Jan 19, 2018 8:55 pm

Sincerely... I'm very tired with this. Maybe it's better to stay with the f**** noise and not disturb any more forum and people :D
All the afternoon testing!
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Re: Noise over Clavinova AUX in

Unread post by Saul » Fri Jan 19, 2018 9:12 pm

Well your certainly not disturbing anyone here. A major part of the reason this forum exists is to help people keep their keyboards, guitars and other gear up and running. Only wish I could help more but definitely interested to hear about your progress and anything you come across.
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Re: Noise over Clavinova AUX in

Unread post by clavifan » Fri Jan 19, 2018 11:31 pm

Thanks Saul,

In another probe I check that the "Optional In" is perfectly clear over the Clavinova headphones output. The noise is only across the speakers, not the headphones.
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Re: Noise over Clavinova AUX in

Unread post by parametric » Sat Jan 20, 2018 1:22 am

Hmm . . .

If the problem does NOT appear in the Headphones, then . . . .

Its looking like the problem is actually with the Amp or Speakers themselves - or connections to them . . . . .

I would have hoped that removing that board - and unplugging all the connectors, then simply

re-plugging them all might have cured the problem.

You are probably going to have to look at a SERVICE Manual to identify those connectors.

CN1 is not very informative . . . . :lol:

Each speaker should only need a two pin plug to the amp board. Try disconnect/reconnect those . . . .

Also, check the wires are connected properly at the speaker itself . . . . .

Also you could try to connect another source to each speaker (to check they DO work) . . ..

perhaps a PHONES output from an mp3 player, just touched to each speaker lead in turn . . . ?

Beyond that, it looks like the Amplifier itself may be faulty?

I have no idea what a replacement board would cost, but only resort to that after a technician

(preferably a Yamaha one) has checked the amplifier you have . . . .

Did you buy the Clavinova from NEW - or is it second hand?

I would seriously DOUBT that the Amps are powerful enough to BLOW the speakers . . . . .

At this stage - having seemingly isolated the likely area, getting a technician to look at it would be best . . . .?

JUST ONE OTHER THOUGHT . . . . When you INSERT the Headphones, does this shut off the Speakers?

If it DOES, then take the headphone jackplug and rapidly insert it In-and-out of the headphone socket.

The Headphone socket contains a SWITCH, operated by inserting the plug - which connects/disconnects the Speakers.

This can get dirty/tarnished with age, causing a BAD connection.

If this proves to be the case, then it can be cleaned (or better replaced with a new socket).

I have fixed many such problems, especially with mixers . . . . .

parametric
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Re: Noise over Clavinova AUX in

Unread post by clavifan » Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:29 am

Hello parametric,

I bought my Clavinova NEW on 1991. Since I have memory, the noise was present (I remember plug-in some walkman or discman).

Yes, when you plug headphones the speakers mute automatically.

I unplug and re plug all this connectors but not luck... there is other board under the uploaded last photo board. I think the board in the photo is a "connector station" and under is the real amplification board (there is a black metal that says amplification with a lot of soldered pins).

On the other side, I searched for a service manual of CVP-55/65/75 series but not luck. There is a database in this forum with manuals?

I will probe today all your questions.

AND CRAZY NEWS!

It is clear that the noise only appears when and RCA is plugged into OPTIONAL IN. If the RCA cable is plugged only in Clavinova and the other side is free, noise is present too. Today I checked again putting the RCA cable with the other side free and noise is again over the HEADPHONES. When I touch the RCA plugs not in the metal part but in the plastic part, and when I move closer my hand to the cable (without touch it) then the noise was increasing over my HEADPHONES. It is like my hand is an interference. And when I touch the cable with my hand (only the plastic cable, the metal pins in the air) the noise increases lots! It's crazy because yesterday I affirmed that no noise was over the HEADPHONES but I think it was a mistake, sorry.

I checked with RCA to RCA and RCA to 3'5 stereo jack cables. Both the same.

If anybody has a service manual I will thank the info. The Yamaha Technician will be the last step.
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Re: Noise over Clavinova AUX in

Unread post by parametric » Sat Jan 20, 2018 4:51 pm

clavifan wrote:
Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:29 am
It is clear that the noise only appears when and RCA is plugged into OPTIONAL IN. If the RCA cable is plugged only in Clavinova and the other side is free, noise is present too. Today I checked again putting the RCA cable with the other side free and noise is again over the HEADPHONES. When I touch the RCA plugs not in the metal part but in the plastic part, and when I move closer my hand to the cable (without touch it) then the noise was increasing over my HEADPHONES. It is like my hand is an interference. And when I touch the cable with my hand (only the plastic cable, the metal pins in the air) the noise increases lots! It's crazy because yesterday I affirmed that no noise was over the HEADPHONES but I think it was a mistake, sorry.
Clavifan . . . .

This is sounding to me like a Bad Earthing problem.

Some part of the circuit, or a component, is NOT earthed properly.

Moving your hand around that causes the problem to increase and decrease as you move, reminds me of a

problem I would describe as a Hand Capacitance effect.

I'm really at the limit of my knowledge here, and it needs someone with better knowledge than me to

explain and confirm that this is indeed the case . . .

(perhaps someone else will come in here :?: :idea: ((i)) )

Yamaha will usually SELL you a Service Manual if you ask THEM . . . . (In our experience) . . . .

A Yamaha Technician should be able to identify and rectify this fault easily.

Does Yamaha have a Service facility in Spain? - In our experience it is always best to TELEPHONE them . . :idea:

If not, any competent Service Facility SHOULD be able to do this.

It would be best if they DO claim to service electronic Keyboards . . . .

let us know how it goes . . . (Y)

parametric
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Re: Noise over Clavinova AUX in

Unread post by clavifan » Sun Jan 21, 2018 7:53 pm

Hello parametric and Saul.

I think I finished. I return to the M-Audio Fast Track Pro. This is the new scenario:

1- Yamaha MU-90 RCA output to M-Audio Fast Track Pro MIC/Instrument input (TS input is unbalanced/XLR-TRS is balanced). RCA to TS cable.

2- M-Audio Fast Track Pro unbalanced RCA output 1&2 to Yamaha Clavinova RCA Optional In. RCA to RCA cable.

3- M-Audio Fast Track Pro powered via USB connected to the PC; this allow me to listen music from my hard disk too.

AND.... NO MORE NOISE!

It's incredible because when M-Audio is powered off, then the static noise comes again, so always I have to disconnect RCA cables from Clavinova's Optional In if I like to play only the piano without the rest of the equipment. If the M-Audio is on, is not necessary to disconnect it.

Why M-Audio can eliminate noise? Why another other source or the same source powered off create noise? It's a mystery to me.

Now no more time for this, but I will investigate more about this rare solution.

Thanks again for your time!!!
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Re: Noise over Clavinova AUX in

Unread post by Saul » Sun Jan 21, 2018 8:58 pm

That sounds like some sort of mains filtering issue. The M-Audio when turned on appears to be acting as a filter and suppressing the noise.

The real question is, was the Clav always like this and were all other models from the same period suffering from this same noise issue?
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Re: Noise over Clavinova AUX in

Unread post by clavifan » Fri Jul 12, 2019 11:04 pm

Hello, here again.

https://gofile.io/?c=eCr7u4

This is CVP55-65 Service Manual PDF. I'm in the same situation of last year. If you can help me with this new material, I will thank you.
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Re: Noise over Clavinova AUX in

Unread post by clavifan » Mon Jul 15, 2019 6:20 pm

parametric wrote:
Sat Jan 20, 2018 4:51 pm
clavifan wrote:
Sat Jan 20, 2018 11:29 am
It is clear that the noise only appears when and RCA is plugged into OPTIONAL IN. If the RCA cable is plugged only in Clavinova and the other side is free, noise is present too. Today I checked again putting the RCA cable with the other side free and noise is again over the HEADPHONES. When I touch the RCA plugs not in the metal part but in the plastic part, and when I move closer my hand to the cable (without touch it) then the noise was increasing over my HEADPHONES. It is like my hand is an interference. And when I touch the cable with my hand (only the plastic cable, the metal pins in the air) the noise increases lots! It's crazy because yesterday I affirmed that no noise was over the HEADPHONES but I think it was a mistake, sorry.
Clavifan . . . .

This is sounding to me like a Bad Earthing problem.

Some part of the circuit, or a component, is NOT earthed properly.

Moving your hand around that causes the problem to increase and decrease as you move, reminds me of a

problem I would describe as a Hand Capacitance effect.

I'm really at the limit of my knowledge here, and it needs someone with better knowledge than me to

explain and confirm that this is indeed the case . . .

(perhaps someone else will come in here :?: :idea: ((i)) )

Yamaha will usually SELL you a Service Manual if you ask THEM . . . . (In our experience) . . . .

A Yamaha Technician should be able to identify and rectify this fault easily.

Does Yamaha have a Service facility in Spain? - In our experience it is always best to TELEPHONE them . . :idea:

If not, any competent Service Facility SHOULD be able to do this.

It would be best if they DO claim to service electronic Keyboards . . . .

let us know how it goes . . . (Y)

parametric
Hello, I'm here again, I put the service manual on the last post, can you help me? Thanks
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Re: Noise over Clavinova AUX in

Unread post by clavifan » Thu Jul 18, 2019 9:37 pm

I found this: https://jestineyong.com/humming-sound-i ... -keyboard/ It's a similar issue but not with the AUX input.

Revising the CVP-55 service manual I can see that the PU-P circuit board has some capacitor near the CN5 input (see some post ago the photo I uploaded with red and green circle).

Are maybe some of this capacitors (see the red points below) the origin of the issue?
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