sustain pedal behavior not as expected [SOLVED]

Covers the Yamaha MODX6, MODX7 and MODX8

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zooterman
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sustain pedal behavior not as expected [SOLVED]

Unread post by zooterman » Mon Dec 10, 2018 1:42 pm

Hi

So I hooked up a sustain pedal to the 'sustain foot switch' jack. The very first press, it worked as expected (sustaining the note).

After that, it remains sustained and the only thing that stops the sustain is depressing the pedal. As soon as I lift my foot the sustain is back.

This seems to be working in reverse. Anyone else encounter this?


Also -- is there a way to make it latch mode so that the pedal need not be held?
Last edited by zooterman on Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: sustain pedal behavior not as exptected

Unread post by parametric » Mon Dec 10, 2018 3:40 pm

It sounds to me like the pedal IS in Latched Mode, - as you need to press it again to "un-latch" it.

A Sustain pedal is normally "Momentary" - as on a REAL Piano . . . .

Probably you need to find the setting in the MODX and change it to Momentary - then it should behave normally . . .

The Yamaha FC3A pedal however DOES feature "Half-Damper" recognition, although the compatability list shown in the <features> tab here:

https://www.yamahamusiclondon.com/FC3A- ... pidYAM-FC3

DOESN'T list the MODX (yet?) . . . .

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Re: sustain pedal behavior not as exptected

Unread post by SeaGtGruff » Mon Dec 10, 2018 4:26 pm

Another possibility is that the polarity is reversed. I didn't see any mention of this in the MODX manuals, so perhaps it doesn't apply to the MODX; but for example in the manual for the PSR-E463/PSR-EW410 it says the following about using an FC5 or FC4A footswitch:
Plug or unplug the footswitch while the power is off. Also, do not press the footswitch when turning the power on. Doing so changes the polarity of the footswitch, resulting in reversed operation.
So (1) do not plug in the footswitch after you've already turned on the keyboard, and (2) make sure the footswitch is not depressed while turning on the keyboard.
Michael Rideout
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Re: sustain pedal behavior not as exptected

Unread post by anotherscott » Mon Dec 10, 2018 7:51 pm

Almost certainly, the problem is that it's the wrong polarity sustain pedal. A Yamaha or Roland pedal should work (or the third-party ones that have switches on them to select polarity, or that are marketed specifically as Yamaha/Roland replacements).

As for your request about a latching footswitch, the Boss FS-5L should work.
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Re: sustain pedal behavior not as exptected

Unread post by zooterman » Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:42 pm

I feel silly, but nonetheless I solved it. My pedal actually has a polarity switch.

But for anyone else experiencing similar reversed behavior issue with their sustain pedal and it has no polarity switch, this thread linked below might be of help:

https://www.yamaha-keyboard-guide.com/t ... verse.html
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Re: sustain pedal behavior not as expected [SOLVED]

Unread post by Stevie18 » Tue Dec 11, 2018 9:41 am

Note that in the mentioned thread people talking about different behavior which happens when you switch on the synth with a pedal with reversed polarity connected. While many keyboards and synths have that behavior, which is a feature to automatically detect the polarity, the MODX and Montage do not have that feature - unfortunately I think. It would be a relatively easy software tweak to do and helps a lot of people. But for whatever reason Yamaha has chosen not to do that in the Montage. I was recently surprised when I borrowed a friend the pedal. He connected to some Yamaha keyboard and it had reversed polarity. I figured that he probably pressed it when switching the synth on and in fact that was the case. So some Yamaha's have it...
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Re: sustain pedal behavior not as expected [SOLVED]

Unread post by auspicks » Fri Jun 14, 2019 7:20 pm

Hello,

I am experiencing a similar issue on the Montage 8.

We tried different sustain pedals and it is the same issue. The first note or chord just sustains when the pedal is not depressed. We tried changing settings in UTILITY but it just does not sustain anymore. We also tried changing polarity but no changes noticed after everything.

The funny is, twould work normally sometimes without any tweaks.

Anyone who can help please?
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Re: sustain pedal behavior not as expected [SOLVED]

Unread post by Kurzweil » Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:04 pm

One time I troubleshot an automotive temperature gauge circuit for a long time after trying TWO new sender units. After all, it couldn't be the sender since I replaced it twice, could it? It was the sender. Both new items had been defective.

You absolutely MUST eliminate the pedal itself from this question. The pedal has to be normally shorted in order to work on Yamaha & Roland. Pressing the pedal causes an open circuit which provides sustain. Your pedal can be tested with an ohm meter or a continuity tester. A light bulb and a battery will do, also. A temporary one can be made with a couple of alligator clip leads and a flashlight. It should show a short when "at rest" and an open circuit (infinite ohms) when depressed. The Korg, Fatar, & Kurzweil pedals behave exactly opposite.

You can mimic the pedal action by connecting an ordinary 1/4" audio patch cord into the sustain jack on the Montage and taking any piece of metal and shorting the other end by bridging the gap between the tip and the sleeve about a quarter inch from the end of the plug; a coin will do nicely. Leaving the cord just laying there should produce normal sustain, which is easiest to detect with an organ or string sound. Shorting the end of the wire should kill the sustain effect. This is kind of opposite what one expects.

If all of the above produce no detectable fault, then the problem likely resides in the sustain jack assembly on the keyboard. Since an open circuit provides sustain, and that is the normal condition of a jack with nothing connected, this particular jack has to be normally shorted when nothing is connected. Otherwise, the keyboard would be in a continual state of sustain. I am thinking that the shorting mechanism in the jack may have become intermittent. Really, the problem can only be in the pedal assembly or the jack if the problem comes and goes. Software rarely changes on its own. This sort of fault is usually caused by someone tripping on the pedal cable, while connected. It breaks a solder connection where the jack is attached to the circuit board. It is usually repaired by opening the unit and using a 30-watt soldering iron to reheat the solder joints under the jack.

If a broken jack is suspected, connect it up as stated above. You should get constant sustain. Then GENTLY put lateral pressure on the plug. I mean just lightly press it sideways in various directions. likely DOWN. That should temporarily break the connection if there is a fault. That is, you may be able to make and break the sustain effect by very light pressure, indicating a broken connection. The next time I connect my Montage, I will try the patch cord trick and report back whether or not I am talking through my posterior or not. I will be interested in hearing the resolution of this problem.
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