Roland GO:KEYS 3 vs Controller with Roland Cloud?

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Re: Roland GO:KEYS 3 vs Controller with Roland Cloud?

Unread post by Saul »

Interesting compariosn of Zenology vs Fantom 06. I didn't know there was that issue with the MFX on the Fantom!

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Re: Roland GO:KEYS 3 vs Controller with Roland Cloud?

Unread post by mx49 »

Saul wrote: Mon May 20, 2024 10:04 am I didn't know there was that issue with the MFX on the Fantom!
Are you talking about the reverb effects?

In this regard, the Fantom is similar to the Montage/MODX: The send effects are part of the "scene" ("performance" in Yamaha terminology), and not part of the "tone". The send effects are shared by all "tones". The Fantom does not have a SINGLE TONE mode. It has a SINGLE TONE button that initializes the scene in the edit buffer to make it useful for auditioning individual tones. The reverb effect is part of this initialized scene. For people who do not like the settings of this initialized scene, it is easy to create a custom PREVIEW scene with customized send effects, and use that scene for auditioning individual tones.
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Re: Roland GO:KEYS 3 vs Controller with Roland Cloud?

Unread post by shelly0624 »

The sound is impressive on the Roland Go 3. I think the piano sounds are way better than the other keyboards I own. They are all under $400, so this is a great bargain for someone like me (on a budget). Really tempting. Just gas costs are staggering here in the US. I was concerned about next weekend and picking up the grandkids again to stay overnight..so close to the end of the month. I mentioned it to them, and I caught my grandson with his hands folded and praying! :lol: Oh my gosh. Priority 1 now. I'm really glad music manufacturers remember those of us.
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Re: Roland GO:KEYS 3 vs Controller with Roland Cloud?

Unread post by Saul »

It is indeed a huge amount of keyboard for the money. I keep going around in circles, one minute thinking I will order one and then going back to the fact that I already have a controller keyboard and access to Zenology so it might be money wasted. None of which I would have been thinking just a couple of years ago. How the world has changed since then!

There is no rush though. It is just the old GAS hitting again. I would like a better quality controller but that is a "like" not "need" and there are other things that demand my money at the moment. So for now at least I think a Roland Cloud sub will do. Anyway I have a couple of new Tanglewood guitars to review. That should keep me busy :)
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Re: Roland GO:KEYS 3 vs Controller with Roland Cloud?

Unread post by mx49 »

AIUI, it is possible to import custom Zen-Core tones that have been created on the Fantom or in Zenology. However, it is not possible to edit Zen-Core tones on the GO:KEYS itself, except for a small subset of parameters, maybe 2% of the Zen-Core parameters. Similar to the RD-88 and RD-08.

Some people only care about presets. For others, I think there are better options. For example, the Roland MC-101 contains also thousands of Zen-Core tones, and in contrast to the GO:KEYS, supports customizing the tones (exposing about 50% of the Zen-Core parameters). For playing live, I think it is easier to produce the required sounds with a fully-customizable previous-generation keyboard (e.g. MOXF) than with a current-generation keyboard without customization.
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Re: Roland GO:KEYS 3 vs Controller with Roland Cloud?

Unread post by Saul »

I can't imagine customising anything on something the size of the MC-101!

It is probably great for creating beats but that is not even close to anything I would want to do. I guess I am just not the target market for something like that. The Go Keys I could more easily justify because it would replace my existing controller keyboard and at the same time be hooked almost permanently to the computer. Although it has the advantage of being standalone when required. Which with me would be almost never.

If I want to do any sort of sound design I would use Zenology Pro which is included with the cloud Ultimate plan, not that I have much interest in sound design. Maybe a little tweaking here and there but mostly the presets are fine for me.
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Re: Roland GO:KEYS 3 vs Controller with Roland Cloud?

Unread post by anotherscott »

davlippo7 wrote: Tue May 07, 2024 11:40 pm Is it multitimbral? I didn't see that in the spec list directly. CK can play 3 at once but it's a lot more expensive & probably more controls.
GO can play 2 sounds at once.
davlippo7 wrote: Wed May 08, 2024 10:31 pm If it's as good as advertised for almost free I pose the same question I did with the SeqTrak Yamaha released.

Why shoot yourself in the foot and undermine your high end gear and make available very affordable offerings that sound as good as a Fantom etc....There has to be a logical catch to risk sales to your main line gear. OR we're getting ripped off on the main line gear that is realistically only worth half of what they are charging us.
This is nowhere remotely near what a Fantom is. It has a very small subset of its sounds and an even smaller subset of its functionality.
davlippo7 wrote: Wed May 08, 2024 10:31 pm IF profit is in the $350 price and the dealer gets a cut this this was made for what $175 and then you have to box and ship it too.
If it sells for $350, raw cost would probably be well under $100. A rough estimate would be that build cost is typically about one fifth of retail, maybe more like a quarter for low cost, high volume items, and probably a lower percentage for high cost, lower volume (or "boutique") items. But besides boxing/shipping, there's also other overhead like warehousing, administration, customer support, import duties, initial fabrication and R&D costs to amortize, warranty service to cover, and then of course profit for Roland, profit for the distribution arm in your country, profit for the dealer.
Saul wrote: Wed May 08, 2024 11:28 pm The manufacturing cost would be a lot less than $175.00. That would be the price a retailer would normally buy at from the manufacturer.
I agree about the first part, but my understanding is that an item that sells for $350 typically costs the dealer about $250.
davlippo7 wrote: Thu May 09, 2024 1:04 am If it's reliable one could attach the SeqTrak to the GO KEYS and do about anything I guess and never need to buy a flagship synth having the best of both Roland and Yamaha for pennies.
With the Roland lacking 5-pin MIDI, I'm not sure you could directly connect it to the seqtrak.

With Roland lacking MIDI controller functionality, it would also not be adept at selecting seqtrak sounds, you'd have to select them as needed from the seqtrak, which looks pretty painful.

At any rate, these are not the flagship sounds of these companies (even if some of these sounds are also in the flagship). Certainly in the case of comparing the Go to a Fantom. The seqtrak might fare a little better, but is still well shy of the sonic capabilities of a Montage M.

But really, if all you want is "the best sounds for the buck," and it's not for gigging, software will beat it. As Saul says, you can get these sounds (and may more) from Zenology, but then you can also add a whole bunch of other sounds besides what's available in zenology, too. So I don't think "the sounds" is the reason to buy the Go, it has to be the whole package... feel, functionality.. and these are (usually) where a lot of the value of higher priced boards comes from, not just the sounds.
Fleer wrote: Sun May 19, 2024 5:08 pm First time in many, many years I’ve seen this quality for so low.
I haven't played the GO so can't compare, but I was very impressed with the Casio CT-S500 for the money. (Which, BTW, does three sounds at a time, to get back to the first question of this post... and also feels more playable for piano than that CK61, though the CK61 has a lot of advantages of its own as well.)
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Re: Roland GO:KEYS 3 vs Controller with Roland Cloud?

Unread post by shelly0624 »

I like the extra bass speaker on the CT-S550 and the CT-S1000V keyboards. That makes them a little heavier in weight than some of the other low-priced portable keyboards, but I have the CT-S1000V and the extra speaker does give the piano a thicker punchier sound.
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Re: Roland GO:KEYS 3 vs Controller with Roland Cloud?

Unread post by Saul »

shelly0624 wrote: Fri May 24, 2024 7:46 am I like the extra bass speaker on the CT-S550 and the CT-S1000V keyboards. That makes them a little heavier in weight than some of the other low-priced portable keyboards, but I have the CT-S1000V and the extra speaker does give the piano a thicker punchier sound.
That would be important for many who would buy something like this. You want the best sound out of the internal speakers that you can get. For me it is not as important because everything goes through my desktop monitor speakers. And even though they are not the best, they are far larger and more powerful than anything in a PSR or the Go Keys.

And now you have me thinking about updating my monitor speakers 🤣
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Re: Roland GO:KEYS 3 vs Controller with Roland Cloud?

Unread post by Saul »

anotherscott wrote: Fri May 24, 2024 4:29 am
Saul wrote: Wed May 08, 2024 11:28 pm The manufacturing cost would be a lot less than $175.00. That would be the price a retailer would normally buy at from the manufacturer.
I agree about the first part, but my understanding is that an item that sells for $350 typically costs the dealer about $250.
It depends on whether a dealer is buying from a distributor or directly from the manufacturer.

A distributor will typically buy in at 50% cost and sell to a dealer at 25-35% depending on the numbers etc.

Dealers buying directly from the manufacturer, which is the case with Yamaha, Roland and Korg, will often pay the same as a distributor at 50% but that depends on a lot of factors. How large the dealership is, what quantity they buy, how many units they shift etc.

Brand artists will also usually be offered the same 50% deal although in their case there is a restriction on resale for the first 12 months.
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Re: Roland GO:KEYS 3 vs Controller with Roland Cloud?

Unread post by sonic2000gr »

Saul wrote: Fri May 24, 2024 10:40 am And now you have me thinking about updating my monitor speakers 🤣
I'm waiting for HS7 to arrive, almost two years after I got the Montage and I am still using some cheap (but cheerful) Edifier speakers with it :/:

But seriously, the top PSR models have very good and powerful speaker systems. My PSR-2100 had amazing audio coming out of the internal speakers and I can only imagine the likes of SX-700/900 having great sound too.

But yes, all the PSR-E versions I've tried are mediocre at best. The actual instruments sound fine however with external amplification. The CASIOs are better in this price range.
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Re: Roland GO:KEYS 3 vs Controller with Roland Cloud?

Unread post by shelly0624 »

My Roland Go 3 is supposed to arrive on the 29th. I'm excited to see how it sounds and what it can do :D I would have liked the step up , the Roland Go 5 because it has the bass boost and mic input, but this is going to be a desktop keyboard for recording. I already have one that has a mic input, something I really love.
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Re: Roland GO:KEYS 3 vs Controller with Roland Cloud?

Unread post by Saul »

sonic2000gr wrote: Fri May 24, 2024 2:12 pm
Saul wrote: Fri May 24, 2024 10:40 am And now you have me thinking about updating my monitor speakers 🤣
I'm waiting for HS7 to arrive, almost two years after I got the Montage and I am still using some cheap (but cheerful) Edifier speakers with it :/:
If it's any consolation I am only using a pair of Behringer Studio USB 50 monitors. They are "OK" but I would like better. A good size for my desk though👍.

I have had the HS7's in the past and they were great but they were on loan from Yamaha so had to go back :(
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Re: Roland GO:KEYS 3 vs Controller with Roland Cloud?

Unread post by Saul »

shelly0624 wrote: Fri May 24, 2024 6:18 pm My Roland Go 3 is supposed to arrive on the 29th. I'm excited to see how it sounds and what it can do :D I would have liked the step up , the Roland Go 5 because it has the bass boost and mic input, but this is going to be a desktop keyboard for recording. I already have one that has a mic input, something I really love.
You can still go for the 5 at a later date Shelly. See how you get on with the 3 and then you will know if the upgrade is worth doing 👍
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Re: Roland GO:KEYS 3 vs Controller with Roland Cloud?

Unread post by sonic2000gr »

Saul wrote: Fri May 24, 2024 6:57 pm If it's any consolation I am only using a pair of Behringer Studio USB 50 monitors. They are "OK" but I would like better. A good size for my desk though👍.
Look more or less similar to my Edifier. But the Behringers are at least sold as studio monitors. Mine are probably ok as general set for spotify / computer use. They definitely struggle a lot handling the Montage sound. I am sure the HS7 will be a big improvement.

To stay on the subject, it seems to me the biggest upgrade of the 5 (except the slightly better speakers) is the dedicated output jacks in the back. If you don't care about these, the 3 is a fine choice.
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